Mini Classifieds

72 pinto wagon. 1 owner. 67K miles
Date: 10/14/2019 08:24 pm
Looking for leaf spring insulators
Date: 04/04/2020 09:38 am
Need 72 pinto parts!
Date: 06/14/2019 01:40 pm
windshield
Date: 04/14/2018 08:53 pm
Runabout rear window '73 to 80.
Date: 01/12/2019 10:19 am
Looking for a 1980 windshield
Date: 07/30/2020 04:51 pm
Pinto Parts for sale
Date: 06/19/2017 02:01 pm
hubcaps

Date: 05/13/2021 05:33 pm
Modine 427 Pinto Bobcat V6 Radiator appears new

Date: 09/17/2024 12:35 pm

Why the Ford Pinto didn’t suck

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suckThe Ford Pinto was born a low-rent, stumpy thing in Dearborn 40 years ago and grew to become one of the most infamous cars in history. The thing is that it didn't actually suck. Really.

Even after four decades, what's the first thing that comes to mind when most people think of the Ford Pinto? Ka-BLAM! The truth is the Pinto was more than that — and this is the story of how the exploding Pinto became a pre-apocalyptic narrative, how the myth was exposed, and why you should race one.

The Pinto was CEO Lee Iacocca's baby, a homegrown answer to the threat of compact-sized economy cars from Japan and Germany, the sales of which had grown significantly throughout the 1960s. Iacocca demanded the Pinto cost under $2,000, and weigh under 2,000 pounds. It was an all-hands-on-deck project, and Ford got it done in 25 months from concept to production.

Building its own small car meant Ford's buyers wouldn't have to hew to the Japanese government's size-tamping regulations; Ford would have the freedom to choose its own exterior dimensions and engine sizes based on market needs (as did Chevy with the Vega and AMC with the Gremlin). And people cold dug it.

When it was unveiled in late 1970 (ominously on September 11), US buyers noted the Pinto's pleasant shape — bringing to mind a certain tailless amphibian — and interior layout hinting at a hipster's sunken living room. Some call it one of the ugliest cars ever made, but like fans of Mischa Barton, Pinto lovers care not what others think. With its strong Kent OHV four (a distant cousin of the Lotus TwinCam), the Pinto could at least keep up with its peers, despite its drum brakes and as long as one looked past its Russian-roulette build quality.

But what of the elephant in the Pinto's room? Yes, the whole blowing-up-on-rear-end-impact thing. It all started a little more than a year after the Pinto's arrival.

 

Grimshaw v. Ford Motor Company

On May 28, 1972, Mrs. Lilly Gray and 13-year-old passenger Richard Grimshaw, set out from Anaheim, California toward Barstow in Gray's six-month-old Ford Pinto. Gray had been having trouble with the car since new, returning it to the dealer several times for stalling. After stopping in San Bernardino for gasoline, Gray got back on I-15 and accelerated to around 65 mph. Approaching traffic congestion, she moved from the left lane to the middle lane, where the car suddenly stalled and came to a stop. A 1962 Ford Galaxie, the driver unable to stop or swerve in time, rear-ended the Pinto. The Pinto's gas tank was driven forward, and punctured on the bolts of the differential housing.

As the rear wheel well sections separated from the floor pan, a full tank of fuel sprayed straight into the passenger compartment, which was engulfed in flames. Gray later died from congestive heart failure, a direct result of being nearly incinerated, while Grimshaw was burned severely and left permanently disfigured. Grimshaw and the Gray family sued Ford Motor Company (among others), and after a six-month jury trial, verdicts were returned against Ford Motor Company. Ford did not contest amount of compensatory damages awarded to Grimshaw and the Gray family, and a jury awarded the plaintiffs $125 million, which the judge in the case subsequently reduced to the low seven figures. Other crashes and other lawsuits followed.

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

Mother Jones and Pinto Madness

In 1977, Mark Dowie, business manager of Mother Jones magazine published an article on the Pinto's "exploding gas tanks." It's the same article in which we first heard the chilling phrase, "How much does Ford think your life is worth?" Dowie had spent days sorting through filing cabinets at the Department of Transportation, examining paperwork Ford had produced as part of a lobbying effort to defeat a federal rear-end collision standard. That's where Dowie uncovered an innocuous-looking memo entitled "Fatalities Associated with Crash-Induced Fuel Leakage and Fires."

The Car Talk blog describes why the memo proved so damning.

In it, Ford's director of auto safety estimated that equipping the Pinto with [an] $11 part would prevent 180 burn deaths, 180 serious burn injuries and 2,100 burned cars, for a total cost of $137 million. Paying out $200,000 per death, $67,000 per injury and $700 per vehicle would cost only $49.15 million.

The government would, in 1978, demand Ford recall the million or so Pintos on the road to deal with the potential for gas-tank punctures. That "smoking gun" memo would become a symbol for corporate callousness and indifference to human life, haunting Ford (and other automakers) for decades. But despite the memo's cold calculations, was Ford characterized fairly as the Kevorkian of automakers?

Perhaps not. In 1991, A Rutgers Law Journal report [PDF] showed the total number of Pinto fires, out of 2 million cars and 10 years of production, stalled at 27. It was no more than any other vehicle, averaged out, and certainly not the thousand or more suggested by Mother Jones.

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

The big rebuttal, and vindication?

But what of the so-called "smoking gun" memo Dowie had unearthed? Surely Ford, and Lee Iacocca himself, were part of a ruthless establishment who didn't care if its customers lived or died, right? Well, not really. Remember that the memo was a lobbying document whose audience was intended to be the NHTSA. The memo didn't refer to Pintos, or even Ford products, specifically, but American cars in general. It also considered rollovers not rear-end collisions. And that chilling assignment of value to a human life? Indeed, it was federal regulators who often considered that startling concept in their own deliberations. The value figure used in Ford's memo was the same one regulators had themselves set forth.

In fact, measured by occupant fatalities per million cars in use during 1975 and 1976, the Pinto's safety record compared favorably to other subcompacts like the AMC Gremlin, Chevy Vega, Toyota Corolla and VW Beetle.

And what of Mother Jones' Dowie? As the Car Talk blog points out, Dowie now calls the Pinto, "a fabulous vehicle that got great gas mileage," if not for that one flaw: The legendary "$11 part."

Why the Ford Pinto didn't suck

Pinto Racing Doesn't Suck

Back in 1974, Car and Driver magazine created a Pinto for racing, an exercise to prove brains and common sense were more important than an unlimited budget and superstar power. As Patrick Bedard wrote in the March, 1975 issue of Car and Driver, "It's a great car to drive, this Pinto," referring to the racer the magazine prepared for the Goodrich Radial Challenge, an IMSA-sanctioned road racing series for small sedans.

Why'd they pick a Pinto over, say, a BMW 2002 or AMC Gremlin? Current owner of the prepped Pinto, Fox Motorsports says it was a matter of comparing the car's frontal area, weight, piston displacement, handling, wheel width, and horsepower to other cars of the day that would meet the entry criteria. (Racers like Jerry Walsh had by then already been fielding Pintos in IMSA's "Baby Grand" class.)

Bedard, along with Ron Nash and company procured a 30,000-mile 1972 Pinto two-door to transform. In addition to safety, chassis and differential mods, the team traded a 200-pound IMSA weight penalty for the power gain of Ford's 2.3-liter engine, which Bedard said "tipped the scales" in the Pinto's favor. But according to Bedard, it sounds like the real advantage was in the turns, thanks to some add-ons from Mssrs. Koni and Bilstein.

"The Pinto's advantage was cornering ability," Bedard wrote. "I don't think there was another car in the B. F. Goodrich series that was quicker through the turns on a dry track. The steering is light and quick, and the suspension is direct and predictable in a way that street cars never can be. It never darts over bumps, the axle is perfectly controlled and the suspension doesn't bottom."

Need more proof of the Pinto's lack of suck? Check out the SCCA Washington, DC region's spec-Pinto series.

Members
  • Total Members: 7,892
  • Latest: Tanar_D
Stats
  • Total Posts: 139,565
  • Total Topics: 16,275
  • Online today: 537
  • Online ever: 1,681 (March 09, 2025, 10:00:10 AM)
Users Online
  • Users: 0
  • Guests: 123
  • Total: 123
F&I...more

My Somewhat Begrudging Apology To Ford Pinto

ford-pinto.jpg

I never thought I’d offer an apology to the Ford Pinto, but I guess I owe it one.

I had a Pinto in the 1970s. Actually, my wife bought it a few months before we got married. The car became sort of a wedding dowry. So did the remaining 80% of the outstanding auto loan.

During a relatively brief ownership, the Pinto’s repair costs exceeded the original price of the car. It wasn’t a question of if it would fail, but when. And where. Sometimes, it simply wouldn’t start in the driveway. Other times, it would conk out at a busy intersection.

It ranks as the worst car I ever had. That was back when some auto makers made quality something like Job 100, certainly not Job 1.

Despite my bad Pinto experience, I suppose an apology is in order because of a recent blog I wrote. It centered on Toyota’s sudden-acceleration problems. But in discussing those, I invoked the memory of exploding Pintos, perpetuating an inaccuracy.

The widespread allegation was that, due to a design flaw, Pinto fuel tanks could readily blow up in rear-end collisions, setting the car and its occupants afire.

People started calling the Pinto “the barbecue that seats four.” And the lawsuits spread like wild fire.

Responding to my blog, a Ford (“I would very much prefer to keep my name out of print”) manager contacted me to set the record straight.

He says exploding Pintos were a myth that an investigation debunked nearly 20 years ago. He cites Gary Schwartz’ 1991 Rutgers Law Review paper that cut through the wild claims and examined what really happened.

Schwartz methodically determined the actual number of Pinto rear-end explosion deaths was not in the thousands, as commonly thought, but 27.

In 1975-76, the Pinto averaged 310 fatalities a year. But the similar-size Toyota Corolla averaged 313, the VW Beetle 374 and the Datsun 1200/210 came in at 405.

Yes, there were cases such as a Pinto exploding while parked on the shoulder of the road and hit from behind by a speeding pickup truck. But fiery rear-end collisions comprised only 0.6% of all fatalities back then, and the Pinto had a lower death rate in that category than the average compact or subcompact, Schwartz said after crunching the numbers. Nor was there anything about the Pinto’s rear-end design that made it particularly unsafe.

Not content to portray the Pinto as an incendiary device, ABC’s 20/20 decided to really heat things up in a 1978 broadcast containing “startling new developments.” ABC breathlessly reported that, not just Pintos, but fullsize Fords could blow up if hit from behind.

20/20 thereupon aired a video, shot by UCLA researchers, showing a Ford sedan getting rear-ended and bursting into flames. A couple of problems with that video:

One, it was shot 10 years earlier.

Two, the UCLA researchers had openly said in a published report that they intentionally rigged the vehicle with an explosive.

That’s because the test was to determine how a crash fire affected the car’s interior, not to show how easily Fords became fire balls. They said they had to use an accelerant because crash blazes on their own are so rare. They had tried to induce a vehicle fire in a crash without using an igniter, but failed.

ABC failed to mention any of that when correspondent Sylvia Chase reported on “Ford’s secret rear-end crash tests.”

We could forgive ABC for that botched reporting job. After all, it was 32 years ago. But a few weeks ago, ABC, in another one of its rigged auto exposes, showed video of a Toyota apparently accelerating on its own.

Turns out, the “runaway” vehicle had help from an associate professor. He built a gizmo with an on-off switch to provide acceleration on demand. Well, at least ABC didn’t show the Toyota slamming into a wall and bursting into flames.

In my blog, I also mentioned that Ford’s woes got worse in the 1970s with the supposed uncovering of an internal memo by a Ford attorney who allegedly calculated it would cost less to pay off wrongful-death suits than to redesign the Pinto.

It became known as the “Ford Pinto memo,” a smoking gun. But Schwartz looked into that, too. He reported the memo did not pertain to Pintos or any Ford products. Instead, it had to do with American vehicles in general.

It dealt with rollovers, not rear-end crashes. It did not address tort liability at all, let alone advocate it as a cheaper alternative to a redesign. It put a value to human life because federal regulators themselves did so.

The memo was meant for regulators’ eyes only. But it was off to the races after Mother Jones magazine got a hold of a copy and reported what wasn’t the case.

The exploding-Pinto myth lives on, largely because more Americans watch 20/20 than read the Rutgers Law Review. One wonders what people will recollect in 2040 about Toyota’s sudden accelerations, which more and more look like driver error and, in some cases, driver shams.

So I guess I owe the Pinto an apology. But it’s half-hearted, because my Pinto gave me much grief, even though, as the Ford manager notes, “it was a cheap car, built long ago and lots of things have changed, almost all for the better.”

Here goes: If I said anything that offended you, Pinto, I’m sorry. And thanks for not blowing up on me.

What should I bring to Knotts???

Started by pintogirl, March 27, 2009, 11:22:59 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

71pintoracer

Last summer I went to a show and a lot of poeple had small canopies that attached to their chairs. Not lawn chairs but those fabric type that plop open. They had fabric canopies that were part of the chair. They may allow that, when you get up to walk around you can just fold it up and slide it under the car.
If you don't have time to do it right, when will you have time to do it over?

blupinto

 ;D And don't forget the sunscreen!  ;D
One can never have too many Pintos!

turbopinto72

It can get hot there and there is realy no shade so make sure you bring lots of bottled water and a hat for sure.
Brad F
1972, 2.5 Turbo Pinto
1972, Pangra
1973, Pangra
1971, 289 Pinto

vonkysmeed

Quote from: Dan on March 29, 2009, 09:46:37 PM
Hi everyone,
  My friend that brings his mustang to Knotts says the officals don't allow umbrellas. Just don't want you to carry it in and not get to use it. See ya there. Dan.

You beat me to it.  No form of shade (tent, ez up, umbrella...) is allowed.  If some wind was to come up, their car could get scratched.  Other than that, you seem to have what to bring covered.  See you there
73 Pinto Runabout
351w from 74 galaxie
Heads from 69 Mercury Cougar
82 Mustang GT SROD Transmission and driveshaft
Mustang II rear end with Fairmont 3rd member
6 point cage

discolives78

My entry form says no 'canopies', I would take that to mean portable tent type devices/awnings for purpose of shading more than one person and/or the vehicle. I don't really think of an umbrella as a 'canopy' ???

When I was in my early 20s I worked for a lawyer as a courier for about a year, I got used to looking for loopholes ;D

Chuck


A virtual version of my last Pinto. Was Registered Ride #111. Missed every day.

blupinto

Well, one way to find out would be to email the FabFords people and ask them what's ok and what's not. I would think it would be stated on the entry form. I'll be too busy drooling at the other Pintos (especially Kim's!) and the other Fords and seeing friends to even think about shade. I'll be slathering sunblock on!

On another note, a little bird (next door! lol) told me my mechanic neighbor Jerry and a couple of his buddies are going up there to look. Jerry brought his Falcon when he had it a few times. All this does is wind me up more!!!
One can never have too many Pintos!

pintogirl

Quote from: Dan on March 29, 2009, 09:46:37 PM
Hi everyone,
  My friend that brings his mustang to Knotts says the officals don't allow umbrellas. Just don't want you to carry it in and not get to use it. See ya there. Dan.

Really? That is a bummer. I wonder if they allow those pop up square cover thingies? I'd have to hang a tarp from the roof rack to the roof rack of another Pinto!! LOL  You would think they would allow some type of shade device!! A hat doesn't cover your whole body!!!! ????
Kim
www.pintobuyersanonymous.com

I have come to realize that I am powerless to cuteness of a rusty old Pinto.

Sacramento CA

Dan

Hi everyone,
  My friend that brings his mustang to Knotts says the officals don't allow umbrellas. Just don't want you to carry it in and not get to use it. See ya there. Dan.
Nothing like a 460 under the hood!!!

discolives78

At this rate, I think I'm going to be funding my return trip by fixing and installing stereos! ;D...I'm planning to fund the trip with whatever money I can come up with! :coolrasta:

My cardboard sign:

Just trying to get to "insert major city here"  :)  or

Have dog, will guard for food.   ;D                 or

Need 50 cents for air...       :lol:

Chuck :afro:



A virtual version of my last Pinto. Was Registered Ride #111. Missed every day.

pintogirl

Quote from: discolives78 on March 29, 2009, 02:15:08 PM
Not if I beat you to it Kim! ;D  I'll even bring stuff to clean & check out the tape deck! We had a yard sale this weekend, I didn't get a chance to install my cassette player yet, but I bench tested it in my brother's bus, and it works like new. Good news about yard sale! I made $50! :o

Chuck :afro:

Cool, you can clean my 8 track and cassette adaptor!!!  ;D 

Are you going to use the money from the yard sale to fund the trip to Knotts????  ;D ;D
Kim
www.pintobuyersanonymous.com

I have come to realize that I am powerless to cuteness of a rusty old Pinto.

Sacramento CA

discolives78

Not if I beat you to it Kim! ;D  I'll even bring stuff to clean & check out the tape deck! We had a yard sale this weekend, I didn't get a chance to install my cassette player yet, but I bench tested it in my brother's bus, and it works like new. Good news about yard sale! I made $50! :o

Chuck :afro:


A virtual version of my last Pinto. Was Registered Ride #111. Missed every day.

blupinto

Yeah- that's a GREAT idea!!! Install Becky's radio!!! ha ha ha!!!  :lol: :lol: :lol:
One can never have too many Pintos!

Fred Morgan

A hat, my face got burnt last year. And tools so you can install Becky's radio.  Fred   ;D
Fred Morgan- Missing from us...
January 20th 1951-January 6th 2014

Beloved PCCA Parts Supplier and Friend to many.
Post your well wishes,
http://www.fordpinto.com/in-memory-of-our-fallen-pinto-heros/fred-morgan-23434/

pintogirl

Quote from: turbopinto72 on March 28, 2009, 01:51:31 AM
Sunscreen, water, lunch, tools and parts just in case, a camera and a hat.

Tools? Why, am I going to be installing Becky's radio??  :laugh: :laugh: ;D ;D  Just kidding!!!  ;D
Kim
www.pintobuyersanonymous.com

I have come to realize that I am powerless to cuteness of a rusty old Pinto.

Sacramento CA

turbopinto72

Sunscreen, water, lunch, tools and parts just in case, a camera and a hat.
Brad F
1972, 2.5 Turbo Pinto
1972, Pangra
1973, Pangra
1971, 289 Pinto

PintoZeal76

Those are perfect things to bring, especially the giant umbrella.
In fact, I'll probably attempt to sit under it, so beware =P
You'll find yourself wandering around and gawking at all the other cars there for a while(yes, we must pay attention to the non-pintos), but otherwise its fun to sit around with other club members in folding chairs and share stories. Plus, its always interesting to hear the comments people make about the cars, and more often than not, you'll spend 10+ minutes with one person because they'll have a pinto story of their own to tell you.

blupinto

Well, don't forget you, Hubby and Miss Ghost! lol. Other than that, good question. I wanted to bring the '74 Pinto brochure too. I know I do want to look at the Mustang IIs and the other Pintos. This is my first show too.
One can never have too many Pintos!

pintogirl

Ok, since this is my first show like this, I was wondering what I should bring?? Is this a show that we can kind of sit by our cars, or do we park them and just walk around???

I plan on bringing.....

Folding chairs, ice chest, and a big umbrella for shade. Does these things sound ok to bring, or am I going to be a dork because I brought a big umbrella?? LOL Any thing else I should bring???

Thanks
Kim
www.pintobuyersanonymous.com

I have come to realize that I am powerless to cuteness of a rusty old Pinto.

Sacramento CA


Welcome to FordPinto.com, home of the PCCA - the Pinto Car Club of America. Founded in 1999 with the goal of creating a dedicated meeting place with strong appeal to Ford Pinto and Mercury Bobcat owners and enthusiasts across all generations. Each day new members join the PCCA family expanding the knowledge base and enhancing our community.


Our site offers extensive information, technical and historic as well as live classifieds ads to find what you are looking for. One of our main goals is to save you time, money and a lot of hassle when searching for information about our cars. Not a member of our family yet? Please feel free to sign up
 for a free account and join the informative discussions in the forums when looking for that tidbit of info you seek. We, the members of FordPinto.com look forward to welcoming you to our family and hearing from you. We are here to assist in any way we can.


FordPinto.com supports the development of parts resources or parts re-manufacturing as opportunities arise. We promote the efforts of individuals and companies that endeavor to re-manufacture, sell, or otherwise distribute additional resources for the Ford Pinto or Mercury Bobcat.

As always, we at FordPinto.com encourage comments and suggestions on how we may be able to improve your experience with us. We take what our members have to say very seriously. Don't hesitate to submit your ideas and feedback.

management@fordpinto.com